Able Baker

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Able is the lead pastor of Fort St James Evangelical Free Church (BC, Canada) and has been a senior pastor for six years. He has a passion for rural ministry, enjoys reading, movies, playing sports, chess, coffee, beer, watching MMA, hunting, fishing, and songwriting (he's written over 25 songs and recorded three CD’s). He's been married to his wonderful wife, Abbe, for 11 years. Together they have three beautiful children (Jackson, Chloe, and Lucy).
  • Disableme

    some things not something’s haha sorry

  • http://www.thinktheology.org Luke Geraty

    Thoughtful post, Able. I have two thoughts that come to mind…

    (1) There is so much that you write that is true about pastoral leadership. In fact, I think you and I would both agree that (t)radition both in rural settings and with small churches tends to be a more powerful concern than for some within churches that are either young or filled with people who have less of a historic connection to some events or methods or models from the past.

    In fact, this post is especially relevant for rural church ministry.

    (2) As an aside, and mostly related to the issue within the CoE, I think it’s totally interesting, as you pointed out on Facebook, that they will not allow women Bishops but will allow for women to be ordained in other significant leadership roles (Deacons & Priests). I’m not sure if it’s a byproduct of your idea that the Laity is holding onto (t)radition though. I think it’s just as likely that it’s a byproduct of how complex their church polity is. Rather than viewing through the lens of an ecclesiology that you and I are probably more familiar with (Elder-Pastor-Bishops and Deacons), they have a variety of different Offices that have a variety of different “job descriptions” that, in my mind, seem to muddy the waters.

    In fact, I think their ecclesiology just makes it perfectly easy to have lots of weird and seemingly hypocritical praxis. Coming from my own understanding of church polity, not allowing women to serve as Bishops but allowing them to serve as Priests and Pastors makes absolutely no sense to me. It seems quite contradictory from a hermeneutical point of view. But I wonder if the organization just makes it easier to have lots of complexities. I’m not sure.

    Anyway, you have several statements that are really worth further discussion. In fact, you write,

    “Visiting the past is a good thing to gain understanding of the present.”

    That’s excellent. So true. Two thumbs up. That’s why Church History and Historical Theology are so important for our theological constructs and that’s why having a clue about our local church’s history is important for pastors to look into before they start trying to change everything and address every “issue” that is there. This statement is very, very, very important.

    You also wrote,

    “Leadership is wise to make room for cultural and social change by incorporating its reality into everyday personal ministry. “

    Able for the win! This is what Missiologists have been saying for over thirty years, non stop, to the evangelical world. Yet the influences of Fundamentalism’s concern for the Mainliner’s rejection of much of Orthodoxy has caused many an evangelical to bury their head in the sand and ignore the culture shifts. Sadly, we have many Christians who are just coming out of their “church bubble” and completely unaware of how they will ever be able to interact with people in today’s world because things have changed sooooo much.

    We must teach people how to discern and think through and interact with society. You need to write more about this issue! It’s sooooo important!

    Great thoughts… loved reading this…

  • Paul Poppe

    Is tradition the root problem in these discussions or is it differing views of the scriptures? Tradition is just common practice that has roots in the past. Those common practices may have roots in scripture and they may not. One of the areas where Jesus went toe-to-toe with the Pharisees was in this matter of tradition that made void the commandments of God. The real task here is not “catching up with the times.” It is looking closely at the scripture and forming our traditions accordingly. A tradition is not bad because it is old. It is bad if it strays from the scripture. Apparently the case has not been made well enough from scripture for the laity in the Church of England that women should serve as bishops.

  • http://www.thinktheology.org Luke Geraty

    Good questions, Paul.

    I didn’t think Able’s post was about having the church try and “keep up with the times” in the sense that the church needs to sacrifice truth in order to stay “relevant.” I took this to be more related to understand that culture HAS made changes. Modernists tend to want to ignore that, historically.

    You said,

    “Apparently the case has not been made well enough from scripture for the laity in the Church of England that women should serve as bishops.”

    This is totally a legitimate statement. Yet don’t you also see that it raises some questions? How is the laity convinced that women can serve in all of the other roles (pastors and priests) while not allowing them to be bishops. They have to reapply passages of Scripture, depending on what “office” they are discussing. It seems a little inconsistent to me.

    That being said, I think it is entirely possible that the Laity simply has a better hermeneutical grasp than does the other two groups :) But that’s my complementarianism speaking… ha ha

  • http://www.facebook.com/ablebaker Able Baker

    Yeah I was just trying to show how traditions can linger and live in odd unknown or unrecognized places. Traditions are not bad unless they become heart idols. Lots of things have roots in scripture.

    “The real task here is not “catching up with the times.” It is looking
    closely at the scripture and forming our traditions accordingly.”

    Paul I see this a bit different. I think we are to live in the tension of tradition and relevance seeing how the new wine needs new wine-skins. I see a need for the church to make room for the new wine all the time as a pastor and it seems like WE as Christians are all slaves to unknown or unrecognized traditionalISM.

    So I agree with you in part Paul.

  • http://www.facebook.com/ablebaker Able Baker

    I really appreciate your thoughtful response.

    I agree with you here that this MAY be the case… “I’m not sure if it’s a byproduct of your idea that the Laity is holding
    onto (t)radition though. I think it’s just as likely that it’s a
    byproduct of how complex their church polity is.”
    I am not sure I know so little about CoE.

    I will think some on how I can write a bit more concerning some of the things you addressed.

  • http://www.thinktheology.org Luke Geraty

    I have often said I would go Anglican very easily… it would take very little convincing. Only one thing would be hard for me… the paedobaptism. Everything else I think I could deal with :) Even the complex polity. ha ha.